THE TWILIGHT ZONE

Hello Mr. Gann,

Some people I know called your Camel Lady story a hoax with likely photoshopping involved.

Unfortunately, my attempt to enlarge the man's face in these photos didn't work.

Nevertheless, looking closely at the sunlit side of his face there appears what seems a second beard, behind the first one, as well as a second cheekline. Enlarging helps. The dark part of what looks like the silver bottomed second beard is easily contrasted against the lit or white side of the first beard.

Some others and I are 95 percent certain it is a second beard, but seems to be that of the same man.

When asking why you might photo-shop a second head of the same man over another, I explained to them that possibly you didn't want folks to be able to identify that chap in real life - which is a decent, innocent reason.

I suggested the chap was perhaps bald on top, or there was some other means you used to make him look different enough. I argued your wild tale about him could even have it that he was dead, since you called the tale legendary anyway, and this too would protect him. I added it would protect you too...since it sounded like you had long ago lost contact and so wouldn't have his permission to use the photo.

This still doesn't prove it is not a hoax. But then, there is still a five percent chance....according to us, that the "mess" on the sunlit side of his has some other explanation besides looking like a different, separate beard.

We hope you'll be willing to comment on this, to start.

FC

What do you mean with he is probably bald on top? :



And I have used his mug as my avatar once, because he looks a lot like me when I was as old as he was in that pic.




I once showed the avatar to my gf, and she said *I* looked nice with that beard, lol. She really thought it was me in that pic.

But I had a beard like that.......... hence my username "Blackbeard".

Well, thanks for the enlargement Abe. The second beard is clear with it, though it suffers some from added light and blurriness.

About the "bald" speculations...

Well, heheh...because, you total suckah, his great "big" hair could easily have been photo-shopped on.

Of course, to see that you would have to give a rat's ass for once and really enlarge the photo and examine it. We call what you have posted the "jeep" photo, the only other one of two we have that has been provided here. For you to do that would take getting over the denial about the second beard on the other "cave" photo, not to mention quite a lot of other symptoms of photoshopping we won't cover for now...

A vainish, even envious chick with normal hair already knows that the outline of his hair in that "jeep" photo, near the back of it, is way too high...even if he did have way thick hair...which is not at all suggested by the "scraggly" hair in the other photo. It'd have to be twice curly to even try to be that high without teasing or some salon visit. Plus again, enlarge it and weep...it is too fuzzy to determine as being "natural". Check out how blurry the lines are on the back of that big hair...

...and add it to the fact that his hairline is impossibly straight along the forehead...there's the big one...which isn't to conclude he was bald...

What a joke, we say. Even if you have extremely thick hair, your foreline wouldn't be that straight. It's unnatural. You have to enlarge to see it...otherwise you are just jerking around here and playing innocent or in willful denial for some unwarranted reason. And you deserve it...because the truth is, I'll bet you if anything that Gann's targets are not to scare people like me, but to mess with jerk-offs in denial like power/talking brujo pup or Emiliolizardo who think they look Big and score somehow feeding off of what they pronounce, "little old lady paranoia", their tongues planted in Wallace's crap, their old history dark as hell, like tbp's mother alleged suicide. Alleged. And now strangely alleged to be due to "all that spiritual shit". Yeah? Oh quick everybody, start talking physics like you have a fucking clue! Lucky for me I wound up talking for years with the real thing, the real scientists, at a pub in a nuclear city.

If making such a point as I've described, then Gann would get my purple heart of hearts. Whatever the case, already, I admire what he does, creative-wise, such as his story about his Grandpa's heart and stinkbait....lol! He's a very, very good writer with a genious for morbid innuendos, imo. Hollywood would/should appreciate it no end. His rambling style is enrapturing and delightful. He's damned good. It's A-plus plus stuff, that's what I say....

What we really found humorous was the feeble attempt to add sunlit streaking to the front of that guy's head hair in the photo you've shown, suggesting a huge lock of hair was sweeping that high up and back in spite of his head tilt, period. Lol, we are chicks. We know. Just for one, that big lovely photo-bleached lock should have fallen far further forward...particularly given his wierd expression, downward glance, and what seems the fast moving gesture of his blurry hand with the fist clenched..and pointing right next to what appears to be a hard-on, (though it was just small enough, nad the implications too ghastly, to cause us dispute) in his blue jeans. One of us suggested he was merely clicking a remote control camera thing. None of us were able to be sure...

We'd ask you what all that immensely fuzzy gray blurry shit is on the forearm with the clenched fist may be. We say it is shopped, to hide identifying tatoos, which of course, as I've explained, would only behoove someone who saved their photos that long and impeccably.

That's hardly the only sign of shopping, which I haven't mentioned yet. There's tons of indications...let's see if you care to find them...
It's because of those, we don't take seriously any vacant jerk who wants to give any of this a quick perusal, ignore the implications of the story, much less the implications found in Tunneshende's Medicine Dream...even if they only want to use that to make dark jokes or succeed in discrediting people for being "paranoid".

Quite possibly our favorite thing is the least provable but laughable. We say that no fashion designer in their right mind would take that white, thermal underwear-looking shirt he has on and cut a V in the neck such as you see in the photo. It's too small, even stupid and useless-looking. It's flat-out idiotic, that V. Chicks say they know...lol.

We think the stupid too-small V was cut so that the white blob thing of that dude's necklace would show up, since otherwise it wouldn't have. And we see he is holding a long-stemmed pipe up to that white blob thing. Just because we are chicks doesn't mean we also don't know how rare it'd be for a "hippy" like that to have a long-stemmed tobacco stem in those alleged years... much less look down so wierdly at it. But hey, you never know, uh.

We are real, real, clear that the Cave photo which goes with this -you know, the one with the second beard, shows that the white blob is a skull - shows a certain fashion taste regarding what that "big white blob" is and we found a tad inconsistent with the whole picture. The Cave photo shows the white blob necklace which the jerk-off was holding to a long-stemmed pip with his fake cut out shirt...is indeed a skull. So we put two and two together...based on this, and much more, to say that the message is "smoking skull", and that the cute story behind all this matches the fact that that the "cave" photo is a reverse negative...at least so far as the Coor's beer can goes...since with photoshopping heads/ faces on top of that, you never know.

Hey, you asked Abe. Sorry if this chased Gann off, but maybe there is something he can say to address what may be our "misinterpetations".

FC

The woman in the pictures looks to be about 15 years older than Patty in the 90s, though.

"alleged suicide"

Again you show that you can't accept that suicide is not that uncommon, and so you reach for the murder card.

None of your photo-shopping stuff is convincing.

That's why I recommended the new "Condemned to Be Free" book by the old hobby sailor in your area. I bet you still haven't bought it.

Just as ssil hasn't bought Jane's book. The evidence inside of these books would shake both of your theories to the core.

Hey, you didn't mention the odd foot in the foreground in the top photo. From where did that come?

Sil hates contrary evidence, pretends it doesn't exist.

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Art for the Masses

oh, go pull that lame shit with their lawyer, talking brujo pup. And by the way, get a name why don't you, so we don't have to dance around your sloth and inanities.

Their own lawyer has stated that she thinks the missing women are alive...or did you care to know that much. I've seen enough to feel fairly confident you'd salute a female lawyer close to the scene....and who knows, she probably even supports a husband who plows her driveway and hangs out on deadwater sites.

Only a willful moron is going to deny the obvious two beards in the photo=shopping. Just what is your little hang=up?

There is some foot I've missed the foreground you say? What are you talking about? I'd love to know. Maybe I've missed something. Or did you mean her foot was impossibly stretched out and laying flat....and nevermind the implications you are too fragile to consider.

This isn't about suicide cards versus murder cards just because you've got serious personal and spiritual issues and for some reason the world taught you that you had clout or were an authority...what a joke that is, for sure.

You're finished, "power".

And I'm not Sil nor even comparable...get over the sick condescending sexism that lets you get away with that...

And just so you know, my mother's brother blew his own brains out. My mother's aunt jumped off a bridge...because to be a nurse in those days, her only calling, was to be a "whore". You jerk. You'd think I'd admit that to the likes of you who can't read more than a two line post without whining and with the likes of Gann's insinuations all along? Oh...right, now "suicide runs in my genes" he? Eat it, power. Let's go, you name-dropping, spoiled, clueless loser....

FC

There are two pictures: one of this Camel Lady and this guy John in a cave. That's where she looks much older than Patty in the 90's.

Then there is this other picture of both of them in front of the jeep. In that picture she looks much younger than in the one made in the cave.



And here's Patty Partin:

This is another pic to go by. I have it in Geuter's book, Filming Castaneda. But I just downloaded it by googling Patricia Partin and images.

This pic is way too small for purposes here. But, I was not able to enlarge it, so far.

What do you think Bill Gann?
Where is the Funny Cloud going with this?
Can you step in?



What do you think Abe?
Is it even the same "patty".


My only error is in speed-reading and skipping over material.
Like anyone else, I only have so much time for vague insinuations.

If they are criminal insinuations ... well ... I'll just watch and see what you all choose to do.

FC, here's an enlarged version of your pic:

Travelers—It took me a while to find this thread. I was busy all week and didn’t notice the mention in the introduction that a thread had been started here in legacy.

I guess the photos first. You PhotoShop folks are good but lost in a beard and tuft of hair. Those images were scanned from slides. I did indeed take them into PhotoShop to dodge and burn a bit to make them clearer—that’s all. The clothes, the hair, timeframes are all real. In fact the cave shot was the best of several—bad light and all in the cave. Those other images would prove the voracity of the images. If I have to scan and post I will but let’s not waste too much time on that. We can go there if we must but we should go on.

Hard on? Damn, I don’t know. John had just gotten out of prison and the ladies were all over him. Fact is in a short time he had a little harem going out there. He was with the Patty but soon had Walt Bickel’s granddaughter following him around like a puppy. When I was trying to get Walt to kick him and Patty out of the canyon, an old girlfriend of mine, a local government archeologist, pointed out with glassy eyes how pretty he was and what a loss his absence would bring. Yea, probably was a hard on.

He was holding a joint and lighting it with a grin in the cave shot. Bickel loved John, was an old man, lived in the desert 50 years, and had all sorts of old stuff. Likely he gave him the pipe. It seems the Jeep photo was taken about a year after the cave. I can look at the slides for date stamps. In the Jeep photo John and Patty were then in the business of taking cheep pot and mixing it with dried Jimson Weed to make a killer headache smoke. I got really pissed at them for giving me some and not telling me what I was smoking. When I was really high, John tried to get me to sign over my gold claim to him. It was those two little indications of his character that caused me to campaign against his living in Last Chance Canyon. The jeep may be a key to identification too, but I didn’t see a license number. Do we know anyone who knew Blue Scout or Castaneda during this time?

Was the thinner shot of Blue Scout taken after my encounter with John and The Camel Lady?

If it was that does present a problem. I thought John and Patty went off on a Bonnie and Clyde crime spree. It was my understanding they robbed a place in Arizona and were sent to jail. John was an old con and who knows what kind of time he would have done or is doing.

Yes, for the record, I haven’t seen or heard from John since those days and worry a tad about my openness with all this. Anyway, I wonder if there is any evidence of Blue Scout doing time. Maybe, if she is the same person as The Camel Lady this time frame thing can reveal the truth. She may look different because she was living a hard drinking life when I knew her.

Truth, by the way, is all I’m seeking here. I don’t have time in my busy life to spend hours PhotoShopping heads and making up stories to entertain a few people who have a Castaneda site. I didn’t know you good witches were here. It was just an accident (or not) that I found your cybercoven. I don’t know if the two Patty’s are the same or not. I want to know, I suggest we take all that attention to detail that finds second beards flipping hair and focus it on that fact.

Let’s start the inquiry by assuming the images are real. I think the key is to look at real facts that can be verified in Patty Partin’s life. Let’s see if there is a time frame that allows for an alter ego as The Camel Lady.

Then, as Black Beard points out, that will lead where it will. Perhaps the shining path to follow will be the one Alex Apostolides may lead us on. When I say I was his friend, that was true enough. But I don’t think I knew the half of who he really was. Looking there might be quite a journey. BillyElmore

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Light words matter

Hi Bill,

Like I said here, and told you in private: there is a possibility that the famous science fiction writer Philip K. Dick was married to a relative of Alex Apostolides. PKD's wife was called Kleo Apostolides, and may have been a sister/daughter/niece of Alex Apostolides.
PKD may even have met Castaneda when PKD and his wife went on a visit to Alex Apostolides, who knows?

Well, just a minute ago I found a blog that explains the family relation between Alex and Kleo Apostolides:

From Anne Mini’s Blog:



http://www.annemini.com/?p=793

Kleo and Alex were sister and brother.

Great that you found the PDK connection to Alex. I was about to e-mail his wife and see what she can tell. Another interesting person is Alex's ex-girlfriend, Anita. She's the one who told me to ask Alex about Castandea. Likely he told her all sorts of interesting things. I think Alex's ex-wife (he actually had several, his last and longest, and also yet another Pattie) might be able to help contacting her.

On the Patty's, I was looking at the earlobes and noses--they seem to match.

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Light words matter

From the looks of both these women, yes, they could be one and the same person.

I now know from experience that you can gain weight quickly by drinking a bottle of wine every day for some weeks.

As you may remember, I had broken some bones in my right hand, and had to stay home for 4 weeks. Because I like wine - and because I didn't have to go to my work every next day - I thought, "WTF, let's party", and I drank a liter of red wine every day. During that period I visited my mother several times. Just out of curiosity I stepped on her electronic balance, and found out I had gained something like 4 to 5 kilos in only 4 weeks.

Some will get a potbelly, some will also get a fat face with that. Maybe Patty was one of those who got a fat face with all her drinking. And then started some strict diet to get as skinny as she was before. All this in just a couple of months.

Only the time frame seems to be off....